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gillworm
Joined: 14 Nov 2002 Posts: 529 Location: London
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2004 22:43 Post subject: Farenheit 911 - a review |
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i'm just back from seeing this film, so this is going to be some impressions rather than a proper review. it's a very interesting, shocking and moving film and i'm still reeling a bit.
first of all, whatever your views on George Bush and Iraq, i urge you to see this film. Michael Moore and his team have assembled some excellent footage and if nothing else, this film will offer you a lot of information that you may not have had access to before.
it is of course biased, and does its best to make Bush looks like a fool, but he aids them every step of the way, the footage of him often shows what an absolute idiot he is without any assistance from Moore. particularly interesting was footage of him on September 11th, carrying out a visit to an elementary school despite being told that one plane had already flown into the World Trade Centre. he continued listening to kids read. when an aide stepped forward and told him about the second plane and other attacks, he carried on, his face plainly saying that he had not a fucking clue what to do...so he did nothing! i'm no fan of Tony Blair but i'm quite sure his reaction would have been quite different
Michael Moore has a great gift for getting people to talk to him and the most moving parts of the film involve the mother of a soldier who dies when his Black Hawk helicopter went down. her family is an army family through and through and she is a thoroughly patriotic woman, but his letters home shortly before his death shook her beliefs. whilst in Washington for a job-related conference she decided to go to the White House but broke down in tears outside, still unable to come to terms with the loss of her son.
early in the film it felt like an information overloadthe facts of the Bush family's continued business dealings with Saudis and the Bin Ladens in particular beggar belief. the archive footage he uses is very impressive, his researchers seem to have searched out appropriate film for any aspect of the argument he chooses to cover.
i'll have to some back when i've digested this a bit more, that'll do for now! |
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Tommy BOO
Joined: 21 Aug 2002 Posts: 3067 Location: here, there, and everywhere
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2004 22:56 Post subject: |
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thanks for the review gillie. i might check out this film later, even though i was sure that it would be some overrated über-anti-american shite.
how long is it? _________________
"Tommy Boo has played a pivotal role in my life. I've looked up to him since I was a kid and he has inspired every note of music I have ever written. The man is a fucking genius"
-BC
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sparky Site Admin
Joined: 01 Aug 2002 Posts: 576
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:07 Post subject: |
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i saw this film yesterday too, and whereas once i would find this sort of documentary shocking, it now just makes me totally disillusioned. why is there no regulatory body for governments? i guess if there was it would just be run by the same crowd anyway.
the worst bit for me in this film was the "precision miltary operation" the us carried out in iraq, where soldiers were encouraged to get themselves wound up before driving their tanks through various towns & villages shooting up 'the enemy'.
they're even allowed to hook up their cd players to the tank's instrument panel, so that the music plays in their headphones - "burn motherfucker burn" is the example the soldiers talk about listening to in the film.
i also note that moore has sent an email round this morning highlighting the film's impressive opening weekend results in us box offices, and suggesting that bush should already have his bags packed and engine started.
surely a very dangerous tactic to tell the american electorate that he's already on his way out and no need to turn out on election day! |
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bravecaptain
Joined: 08 Feb 2003 Posts: 859
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:37 Post subject: |
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>>i might check out this film later, even though i was sure that it would be some overrated über-anti-american shite. <<
What would have made you so sure of that Tommy? x |
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Tommy BOO
Joined: 21 Aug 2002 Posts: 3067 Location: here, there, and everywhere
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 13:38 Post subject: |
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bravecaptain wrote: |
>>i might check out this film later, even though i was sure that it would be some overrated über-anti-american shite. <<
What would have made you so sure of that Tommy? x |
Well... It's now in fashion to hate everything somehow related to the USA. It doesn't even have to do anything with the war or the US Government - it's a fact that many people hate
all
Americans just because their leader (who does
not
represent the whole nation!) is a world-class dickhead.
Also, everyone has been raving about this film for ages and I've almost lost my interest on it because it's
so
overhyped.
The war in Iraq is a bad thing of course and USA's foreign policy and their politics in general are shite and unfair to the rest of the world, but too many people now see the whole USA as an evil force, just like the Empire in the Star Wars movies. (George W Bush = Darth Vader?)
I find it quite worrying that complete 'outsiders' of the war on terrorism (or whatever the
official name
of the war is at the moment!!) have been blinded by their hatred of America so much that they are now cheering when the terrorists kill American soldiers. They don't obviously understand that the fuckheads who smashed the WTC towers and the ones behind the Madrid bomb strikes aren't actually heroes either!
The Americans could have done this whole operation somewhat properly but they already fucked everything up in the beginning. They made up some lies to justify their attack to the Middle East, but things didn't go like they planned and now George W and his friends are in deep shit. Ha!
Anyway, I believe that their operation just made the whole terrorism problem even worse - they don't seem to realise that their actions actually generate more terrorists. Americans bomb the homes of Iraqi people and give them McDonald's and Coca Cola instead... (and steal their oil resources but no one's supposed to talk about it) ... and they expect them to be grateful and happy. How stupid is that?
Hmmm. Does this make any sense?
Oh well. I think I'm going to see this film soon... _________________
"Tommy Boo has played a pivotal role in my life. I've looked up to him since I was a kid and he has inspired every note of music I have ever written. The man is a fucking genius"
-BC
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sparky Site Admin
Joined: 01 Aug 2002 Posts: 576
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 15:24 Post subject: |
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we told them over and over again that their attack would increase the threat of terrorism, though i'm sure they knew that anyway. there is now such hatred over there towards the west and understandably so.
i just hope the majority of the population in countries that have been consistently bullied by america and its allies realise that it's the politicians rather than the populations of america and co that want to run our world this way. the populations of uk & america & iraq have a lot in common in terms of the way we feel about us foreign policy and perhaps we should be clubbing together to fight it rather than bombing each other!
i have recently started to wonder if michael moore is a us government plant, created to provide an outlet in the media for just enough dissent to give us all something to cling to when in reality nothing has or is likely to really change. i'm sure the issues will be the same 50 years from now.
i know that last bit isn't true but it sometimes feels that way! |
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Setareh Juventina
Joined: 01 Dec 2002 Posts: 1415 Location: Norrköping, Sweden
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2004 18:00 Post subject: |
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"it's a fact that many people hate all Americans just because their leader..."
Many? And how do you know this is a fact? Cos I know many people who fo not like the USA as a government but are okay with their people.
John Simpson, BBC middle east correspondent (who's written books about the subject) said he was once in Iran reporting on anti-British demonstrations (this was years ago, before the 79 revolution). So they were chanting things like 'death to Britain' and then when John started talking to them and presenting himself as a reporter for the BBC they'd be sweet and kind to him.
"i have recently started to wonder if michael moore is a us government plant"
Haha...my mama was saying that a week ago. That maybe they want to show the 'ugly' face of left winged politics...but none of us really believe that either.
However, anyone who knows anything about US foreign policy and the CIA in particular will always be seeing possibilities of strange actions by the US government.
I mean, Guatemala was ruined, its people murdered, all because Guatemala wanted to put a tax on the bananas they sold...
Love and Peace _________________ Man is the only animal clever enough to build The Empire State Building and stupid enough to jump from it. |
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Guest
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Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2004 21:48 Post subject: |
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regardless of your stance on Iraq, you should see this film because of the amount of information it will give via the impressive range of news and behind the scenes footage. Michael Moore pitches his films as 'everyman' level, which means that it isn't po-faced politicking, it will appeal on several levels and frankly at times it's laugh out loud funny. It's a little long at two hours but that time rarely drags.
you know, Michael Moore gets really annoyed when people call him unpatriotic, he considers his patriotism a driving force behind his film making, it's exactly because of his love of his country that he makes these issues-based films. There really aren't many film makers and artists willing to step up in this way and say 'I think x, y or z is wrong with America'. |
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Kris
Joined: 16 Sep 2002 Posts: 2550 Location: Sheffield
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Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2004 21:57 Post subject: |
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I know that Michael Moore is patriotic but sometimes he doesn't help himself.
If you were to read "Dude! Where's My Country?" you would get the impression that he thinks all Americans are complete idiot's and that France is a lot better with nicer people.
Kinks
xxx _________________ "fashioned by the blade of a world that doesn't care,
feeling so removed, drifting thru stealing air then...
pause and think about it, try to move and shift the pain, but it's there you feel it kicking and you scream and feel alive." |
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gillworm
Joined: 14 Nov 2002 Posts: 529 Location: London
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Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2004 22:08 Post subject: |
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damn, that's the second time I've logged in and appeared as guest!
I work in a tourist attraction, most of our visitors are American and a huge percentage of them are remarkably stupid and rude.
I'd rather have Michael Moore with his faults than no Michael Moore at all! |
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Setareh Juventina
Joined: 01 Dec 2002 Posts: 1415 Location: Norrköping, Sweden
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Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2004 08:14 Post subject: |
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"I work in a tourist attraction, most of our visitors are American and a huge percentage of them are remarkably stupid and rude.
It is scary how often they fall into their stereotype. And sometimes this is true other nationalities.
One girl I was talking too (neither of us adore the USA or anything) brought forward a point though...we understand English so evertime yanks are being dumb we hear it. Where as if a Hungarian person says stupid things to his friend, you never knew it.
Love & Peace _________________ Man is the only animal clever enough to build The Empire State Building and stupid enough to jump from it. |
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